Fire Hazard Prohibition of Cheap Fans, Can Lights or Cut-In LED Edge Lights

The just-prior post at this blog is a  call that all residence attic access portals must be suitably air-tight and resistant to fire propagation. By the same reasoning, ban ceiling lights that penetrate drywall, leaking energy and propagating fire. Where the USA has surrendered leadership in lighting concepts to myriad fabricators in China, clip-in LED edge lights have become a madness tipping point. These clip-in lights dominate big-box store displays, ruining homes with ceiling cuts nearly as big as the light lens diameter.

Many posts at this blog deal with air-tight disk-LED installation in strong RACO 175 steel boxes. There is much reporting of the fire-resistant and efficient replacement of awful can lights, with box-mounted disk LEDs. With factory-produced drywall rings precut to can OD and RACO 175 octagon ID, and with some patching grout, a can light may be upgraded in an affordable few minutes. Of many jobs with lighting improvement, one of Winter 2014 is most memorable, for thorough presentation of the math of energy savings. This home built in 1988 was the subject of four blog posts already:

Math Of Under-R12 Attic Floor Insulation Rule, For Incentives, March 17,2014.

Daring To Collapse and Rebuild Crummy Loose-Fill Fiberglass Insulation, March 6, 2014.

A Skylight Insulated >R30, With Plywood Hard-Covering , July 14, 2014. Photos 

Can Light Replacement Math, January 2, 2016

I was called to improve personal safety and the capacity for attic storage. I added fire safety at the attic access, but was not yet mindful of other ceiling penetrations as matters of safety against fire propagation.

A silly hinged wood door opening to dangerously small headroom, gave little storage potential nearby, over tops of 2x4 truss bottom elements, among loose-fill fiberglass insulation. Something smarter was wanted.

At planned egress to the attic under the roof peak, see that there is no fire separation of garage and house attics. An attic ladder to be added, must be thirty minutes fire-rated, matching surrounding 1/2" drywall. Yes, this garage ceiling has 1/2" drywall. 

I offered this new "Calvert Recovery" Size 2248 fire-rated attic ladder, set in 2x4 trusses strengthened as better than 2x10 framing. Good Calvert USA ladders with small premium for fire rating, were a fleeting opportunity in 2014. The Maryland attic ladder business operated for about ten years, beginning with a few wood attic ladder models built in the Czech Republic. Ladders then Made In USA had novel features including frames and steps built of best 3/4" plywood, stiffer and stronger than ordinary wood.  The factory closed in 2016.

The Calvert fire-resistant door is of heavy 3/4" thickness treated-composite wood. Not rated, but at least U = 0.25, with affordable heat loss when properly gasketed.

Here the installation is fire-sealed about the ladder frame, with a strong taper of flexible grout covering reveal of the wood ladder frame. I do not use wood trim, that usually just hides shimmed large clearances about the frame, defying the fire rating.

With the better access,  replace a badly-installed-as-usual noise-maker bath fan.

Does this look like much of a fire barrier to you?

Plastic bodies, thin aluminum frames and large flame paths at air gaps are fire-propagation hazards.

Don't expect to find an offered fire-rated bath fan.

The aluminum flex duct too, will incinerate quickly, although slower than a silly plastic duct.

We find duct foolishness like this even with a kitchen exhaust fan sometimes, Here it is not a building code violation. A much shorter duct directed through-roof,  is just common sense, and is required by rebates sponsor Energy Trust of Oregon.

I offer only simple and rugged Panasonic bath fans as replacements. The solid steel body with penetration only at the duct bell, might sport a 30-minute fire rating if required. It clearly is improvement. The hard-plastic grill is not an accelerant of flame.

Preset the outlet bell assembly standing alone, clipped to drywall.

Insert the body from below, sliding past and securely attaching to the outlet bell assembly

There will be no fire propagation about the fan body.

Wall header gaps commonly 1/8" surely propagate fire that has penetrated walls. Learn to see sealing of gaps as mandated by fire-prevention codes.

My flexible grout, chemically similar to Custom floor tile grout, will not carry flame. 

Foam foolishly prescribed for weatherization contractors, is immediately skinning, and rarely bonds airtight. The foam itself is quite flammable. Foam sealing must be forbidden. I remove and replace foam whenever found. What a mess. What a crime.

Two incandescent bulbs upon porcelain lamp-holders supplemented the twist CFL bulb of the garage door opener, in a dismal garage. The 2 7/8" fiberglass box with knockouts, and large gaps to drywall, both propagate flame.

There is no economy in junior box size; crammed wiring is less safe. A best LED light now demanding converter space in the box, is not possible.

Install air-tight RACO 175 boxes with mount structures built of scrap 3/4" plywood and select 2x4 remnants.

Install Lithonia Versilite FMML 7 830, two places. 

Note to self nine years later: I must fully grout the RACO 175 to drywall annulus despite nearly airtight enclosure when the luminaire is pulled against the ceiling. Keys for mounting screws admit bugs seeing light through the box annulus.

Lighting in the garage remains barely adequate. In a wished  return visit look for bugs in light lenses, and offer more light positions.

I have no room-side photo record of six can lights found  in the kitchen, holding hot 150 watt incandescent floods by my records. 6 1/4" OD cans had especially large annular gaps, to 7" drywall cuts. Can interiors must have been loaded with cobwebs.

Lightolier cans over the kitchen have the usual obstacles to absurd covering of a non-IC can with a Tenmat Hat, never air tight to the drywall, little resistant to fire, not resisting energy losses, certain to be thrown off by pressure differential in a fire.

Poorly-accessible space over the kitchen sink was warmed with lack of insulation, congenial to mud wasps.

The better kitchen ceiling has the 7" opening of a can invisibly and quickly replaced by a ring of GP Densarmor drywall, fitted to a heavy-gage steel RACO 175 deep junction box. There are no leakage paths from the box, to the attic. This is fire-proofing!

The drywall ring has full penetration grouting at the OD and at the RACO interface. I have built and installed hundreds of these mount structures built of scrap 3/4" plywood and select 2x4 remnants. Two screws attached through the ceiling drywall pull the patch into alignment.

6" Glimpse LED disks are not glaring. They are pretty.

A bit of fire-proofing, however much perpetual energy saving was the sure achievement. Those savings are detailed in the linked prior blog posts for this home. Copy the math statements here:

The can annulus diametral clearance was 7” - 6.25 = 0.75”, quite large. The frame was not pushed against the ceiling, and probably did not further constrict the passage of leaking air. Each can light had a gap of up to 7.8 sq in.  Apply Insulation Math for a Portland, Oregon home with a common 88%-efficiency furnace. The annual cost of heating lost air is $0.555*Path Area, $4.30 per year. At four places I replaced a 65 watt incandescent downlight with a 750 lumens 14.5 watt LED. Another can that had a long-dead 65 watt incandescent was patched out. At the sixth can, over-sink, I installed a 450 lumens 9.5 watt LED in place of a 150 watt incandescent downlight. 

Apply Insulation Math . Completing insulation in the floor should save, at each light:
$2.4 * Baffled Area, sf* (1/3 - 1/50)  = $0.75 * Baffled Area, sf
= $1.30 per year for an 18” baffled circle (1.8 sf).
= $3 per year for 4 sf uninsulated over the kitchen sink

There is about $6 per year typical savings from air sealing and insulating each very leaky non-IC can light. 

Additionally, credit $12 per year electricity savings vs. the found 150 watt incandescent flood bulbs, with basis $0.11 per KWH. 

Overall annual savings for the home due to my work:

$116 (22%) Fix Kitchen Lights

$160 (30%) Insulate Attic Walls to R30

$101 (19%) Seal Wall Headers

$199 (29%) Insulate Attic Floor to R38

$536 total annual energy savings

 A small flight of steps beyond the ladder egress serves much of the added storage area, little obstructed by truss uprights.

.Treasure was was waiting to be found in the efficiency, safety and usefulness of an attic.

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Added content 9/3/2023:

With the encouragement of a received comment, add details in this job, of the bath fan replacement, that is is fire-resistant as can be. I replace awful plastic noise-makers with solid-steel-boxed basic Panasonic fans. See posts Label Bath Fans., steel-ducted through the roof just as is code-required for kitchen exhaust fans with their grease-fire propensity.

Review, Westgate 4" LED Retrofit Kit

Do you want something better than this in your closets and hallways? You must, as a matter of safety and compliance with building codes, even though your hardware store may sell only the bare bulbs and cheapest porcelain fixtures.









For much of 2017, your choice as an Amazon shopper might have been 4" GetInLight . 

An eternal hallway night light:

This 4" GetInLight draws 9 watts to produce 550 lumens, double the downward illumination from a 60 watt incandescent dimbulb. Adjusted to equal illumination, the bug-proofed GetInLight draws 4.5 watts, a reduction of more than 90%. That is nearly the full savings that is achievable with LED lighting, easily available now. This will shine on for at least thirty years with no need of maintenance, if AC Driver On Board lights are as durable as external converters of DC LEDs.  Here over a guest bedroom door as a night light, the achievement is safety. There was no light here before.

On a bug-proofed RACO 175 junction box, 4" GetInLight draws up to gasketed sealing, via an awkward adapter ring. GetInLight has been a worthwhile nuisance, for lack of the adapter plate now included with a nearly identical 4" Westgate LED. Exactly identical boxes are the clearest indication GetInLight and Westgate are made in the same China factory. Amazon is the actual importer. Westgate and InLightMotion don't manufacture anything.
 



As an Amazon shopper in December 2017, you will find the Westgate now reviewed here, a better light and a better deal than the slimmer, more sleek GetInLight still offered at Amazon:


Westgate 9W 4" Dimmable Disk LED Surface Mount Disc Downlight Kit Accessories Included - Spun Aluminum Housing - Energy Star Rated - 550-600 Lumens 120V (1, 3000K Soft White) 
Your cost: about $14. Go for it. With the Seoul Semiconductor Driver On Board, it will readily mount to any ceiling junction box, however overloaded with wiring and however unsafe from overheating of wires by those 100 watt or bigger bulbs you can't buy anymore. You want more light. You want safety. You want to do your part saving energy and money.

Here see the important box adapter plate that Amazon fails to ship, with GetInLight. See the very many paths that glow brightly within a can light or junction box, impossible of sealing. A bug entering the junction box will certainly die upon the luminaire lens, seeking and never finding, the heaven of diode contact. This is my typical installation on a sealed-bug-proof RACO 175 steel junction box. The deep RACO 175 boxes have been necessary for LED disk downlights with a bulky external driver from house AC power. See that even with the adaptable and rugged RACO 175, caulking is needed to keep bugs out.

Please find my positive review of this light as a Google Photos Album . Know right away that you must do better than the simple adoption suggested so far. Wiring with decrepit electrical insulation must be replaced. If your junction box is old and leaky or if you stuff this into a 4" can light, you will be happy, for awhile. Then you will see the lens darken from litter of dead bugs. LED lights do attract bugs, especially where seen from the ceiling interior as bright points, the stars that denote vertical wrongly and then madden.

Get used to LED disk downlighting. It doesn't look like your bulb, but it lasts forever, and saves more than 90% in operating cost versus point-source incandescent. Few of us have tried these, but they are our illumination of the future. We quickly see them as beautiful, and that will be especially true of the shapely little Westgate light

The Westgate-included adapter plate at the back side is released from the luminaire assembly and becomes part of the ceiling interface. Keyways in the luminaire are at 2 3/4" pitch, and the adapter plate reaches out to 3 1/2" pitch more-commonly found.

Now consider Westgate luminance (glare) numbers. Diode luminance and array luminance are both small compared to a glaring light like Nicor DLS4.

Assess brightness of the Westgate LED, comparative task illumination at my comparison stand. During evaluation of an EiKO LED edge-light, compare several LED luminaires stage left, against a 100 watt point-source incandescent bulb at stage right. The point source bulb is that still legally sold, Philips EcoVantage 1490 lumens, 72 watts. Choose LED luminaires of 3000° color temperature with large beam angle typically 120°.

4" Glimpse of 2013, called 450 lumens, at left. Philips EcoVantage "100 watt" bulb at right. I have made this comparison many times, always finding equal brightness and slight difference of color temperature with bulb nearer 2700°K. I call both "B4", by definition. This is the brightness by which very many homes with 8-foot ceilings have set luminaire spacing. B4, about 500 lumens, will be the goal in usual LED swaps for closets, narrow hallways and small bathrooms. In larger rooms with want of productive activity, we will want more than B4 in swaps upon existing junction boxes. More light is good.

The luminaire at left in this photo is Westgate 4". The Westgate is only a bit brighter. I have found in very many comparisons that a "100 watt" bulb gives task illumination comparable to a LED disk of about 500 lumens with about 120° beam angle. Question that the Westgate is 600 lumens.

Now Westgate 4" LED called 600 lumens is at stage left. Eiko called 650 lumens on its box front is at right.  The Eiko is identified as 800 lumens in its Lighting Facts label.

More Interesting or Egregious Attic Photos

What is the high end of what we can achieve with Norwesco RV038 roof high vents? For this conversation, start out seeing a real limit. Wasps ruined the small space between screen and hood, of this one.

I wonder what this means, to this possibility . We are reminded that RV038 may be fully disassembled from above, a plus. I am obliged to go back to my customer, to offer cleaning of his vent.

That customer did not wish for repair of this bath fan roof cap. A flex duct end had been positioned below the roof paper, and the fan never developed enough force to lift the cap flapper. Children grown. Fan not needed.

Look at this concentration of soffit vents at the base of a cathedral ceiling over the home grand staircase.

Here is one of the roof joist bays of that cathedral ceiling, open to the attic. Outside air entering the soffit openings is as likely to flow under the silly ill-fitting R19 batt, as over it. The ceiling is not insulated.

Here I have taken down a T12 two-dead-bulb fluorescent fixture in a walk-in closet.

Remember: tubes were black.

To wire the fluorescent fixture, detachable sides in two can lights were - - detached. Where the fixture roof sagged from two screws, this left large openings from the closet to the attic, with conditioned air well-enjoyed by spiders.




















Where I replaced the cans and fixture with RACO 175 junction boxes and wonderful Nicor DLS10 LED disk lights, I could insert a very-wonderful Fakro LTK 22/47 ladder between. Note RACO 175 junction boxes ringed by drywall cut from the ladder opening, sealed in and texture-matched with my flexible grout .

LED disk lights are so much brighter, such pretty jewels, that will serve on forever. Brightest-possible light is wished in a closet.

A home inspector barely managed to arrest a bad fall, hanging onto the truss elements at RHS, making for that distant furnace pad. There were things to be fixed, identified in the inspector's photo report. Strange trusses missed connectors that might resist collapse roll-over if flimsy OSB sheathing, weakened at large high-vent cutouts, should buckle in a high-wind event. One could not safely get to the attic furnace. The inefficient home with crummy HVAC ducts in attic and crawl space effectively not insulated, needed two furnaces.

I made it to the furnace pad OK, not trusting the springy OSB for hanging-on, in a foot thrust to the revealed 2x4 bottom truss element. I swung along that RHS truss line. I expected to find no insulation under the 30 sq ft furnace pad. Instead I found this. Pad framing is perpendicular to trusses, and batts within that framing rest atop truss bottom elements, out of contact with drywall and of no value. How shameful! Who would not understand this?

I got home safely, 63 miles round-trip and most of a day invested. I offered clever blocking of truss roll-over, and a 200 sq ft strong plywood-decked pad, insulated R49, bridging the access hole and a jacked-up furnace, for modest $1250.  I never heard from the mean realtor representing the seller and wanting cheapest repairs.